The time has come [the walrus said]
The time has come to offer a few explanations, a few apologies, and a whole lot of thanks and appreciation as my first month (and a bit) in the blogging world has reached its end.
Apologies:
I'm sorry if a lot of my posts and comments have seemed a little on the gloomy side.
Explanations:
The reasons for this are twofold:
- As I think I've said ad nauseum, this is kind of the way I am. Whether this is changeable or not I don't quite know yet; nor am I sure whether I ought to try and change it. I just seem to be attracted to considering hard things, and unpleasant things, because I don't like the idea of leaving them unconsidered. I don't like to feel I'm turning my back on the things that make me uncomfortable; I would rather get myself into a complete mess trying to face things that may be too big for me or too morbid, than carry on living in the knowledge that there are incongruities in my worldview that I'm too afraid to address. Of course there are plenty of things I'm still running away from and avoiding; but one thing at a time I guess. Also I just prefer the melancholic type of beauty, for some reason. Happiness is less interesting than despair. [think of me what you will for that comment.] This doesn't mean I'm a depressive or even unhappy person; my inner turmoils seldom seem to manifest themselves on my face, or even in my mood. And like everyone else, I am quite able to put these things aside from time to time and just have fun. To tell the truth, I kinda like being the way I am, at least in this regard.
- I've been going through a wierd time recently. I've talked to a few of you about this, and been very encouraged by your thoughts. For about as long as any of you have known me - since about May - my mind has been playing some very nasty games with me in regard to my faith, which has taken a serious beating these past few months. It was like my whole grasp on why I believed everything I believed just eluded me suddenly - quite literally in one afternoon - and since then I've been really struggling to get it back, or just to find something to grab a hold of. Well, I'm exaggerating a little; my belief in God and His goodness hasn't left me - it's actually just Jesus I'm struggling with. It's been my Arabic studies that've done it, which include a 20% Islamic culture component (hence I'm going to this conference about Muslims instead of coming to camp on Friday). When it suddenly hit me, as it never had before for some reason, that we might all be just plain wrong, it completely floored me. I couldn't take communion, I couldn't sing at church, I felt guilty every time I prayed, and I felt like an utter fraud when I was leading my cell group or the worship at church, or giving spiritual advice to people that asked me for it, and I got into tangles whenever I tried to read the bible. It's been by far the hardest thing I've ever faced (in my short and extremely easy life). And I'm not quite through it yet, though I've made some progress. So anyway, I'm not quite sure what kind of impression you have all got of me in the short time you've known me, but I would ask you to bear in mind that I haven't exactly been my 'normal' self recently.
More apologies:
I'm sorry for my initial stand-offishness when I first appeared on the scene. I'm thinking particularly of the Geraldine camp, at which I made a very poor effort at being sociable or friendly. Maybe it didn't come across that way, but if it did (of which I would not be surprised), I'm sorry for it.
More explanations:
This was because of a combination of shyness and unwillingness to let people see what was churning away inside me, which for a long time I was quite ashamed of, and didn't want anyone to know about. Partly for fear of you thinking me heretical and so on, partly for fear of rocking all your boats with my confusion and questions. Also it just so happened that at the time of the camp I was feeling particularly despondent and confused, and on this occasion it really did affect my mood.
Thanks and appreciation:
That said, I now want to express something of the great volumes of gratitude I feel to all of you, and to God for bringing you all into my life at this difficult time. I am so inspired by you all.
I've been so encouraged to find that there are people like me out there, several of whom have gone through some of this stuff, who won't judge me for it, and can empathise with my struggles.
My mate Argenbargenschwargenwhargen (the Big Bad Bear), for example: thanks for reminding me that I'm by no means the only one to have had these thoughts. (Also for making me laugh. Heh, you're cool.)
Nato, thanks for always encouraging me to be myself and enjoy it. It's appreciated. And for challenging me to know the bible better.
Heh, while I'm at it, let's go slightly off topic and do this thing properly [in no particular order]:
Jimmy, thanks for being your marvellous friendly self, and for remembering who the heckI was when I turned up at your house for the Star Wars evening [giggles]. Oh, and for always walking me to my car after a gig if it's all dark and dangerous, thus allowing my father to sleep easy :)
Andre (if he reads this), also thanks for stopping to say hello in the hallway that time, remembering my name after meeting me once, and thereby encouraging me to keep going to CU. Yeah, it's the little things. You're an inspiration to shy folks like me.
Ruthie, thanks for inviting me to your birthday after meeting me once. And for taking me out to lunch, and for praying for me, and for being cool.
Estie, thanks for thinking I'm nice :) I think you're nice too. Your passion for God inspires me.
Reuben (whom I've hardly met in real life), thanks for inspiring me towards greater godliness - what greater gift can a person give? - and for being a fellow think-too-mucher.
Andrew, thanks for reminding me what it is to love the word of God, and to study it diligently. And thanks for freaking me out with your alternative interpretation of Romans (Reuben this is for you too), which, though I'm still not sure about it, was one of the things that helped me remember how to approach Jesus. Don't quite know how it did that, since it confused me even more, but somehow it helped me feel able to get back on board.
Brett, thanks for the constant source of inspiration you are to me in your pursuit of God. You are undeniable proof that God lives and saves and works. [hug]
Michelle, thanks for making me laugh at myself, and for your steadfastness.
Vance, thanks for thinking I'm cool even though I think too much!
Chad, thanks for helping to facilitate my technical transition into the blogging world. And for valiantly leading the way through a field full of brambles in the dead of night that time, from which I emerged with barely a scratch :) And for reminding me not to be too hard on myself.
Brehaut, thanks for introducing me to Homestar Runner, without which I don't know where I would be today! And for keeping me company in the library. And for being a geek and proud of it! Yeah, respect! Also for jamming with me at camp. That was fun.
Kelly, thanks for being gorgeous, and for being you, which is a compliment in itself.
Lyndon, thanks for frequently distracting me from studying for tests and things, which aren't nearly as much fun as talking anyway, and for teaching me the gee-tar, and for being my cuzzie bro.
***
Uh, the awkward moment when I wonder if I've forgotten anyone... Anyway, I'm sure you get the picture. I love you all. The next step would of course be to say these things to you all in person... hm, too hard [shamefacedly].
Anyway, hopefully now you will all understand me a bit better. I still haven't quite reached the other side of this thing yet, but thanks partly to you guys, as well as several other people, I'm feeling okay these days anyway, which was more than I could say this time a month ago.
***
May your tails grow long and your eyes be bright, and may all your squeaks be little ones.
(benediction from 'Brambley Hedge - Summer Story' - any nods of recognition?)
posted by Kat | 9/23/2004 11:17:00 am
9 Comments:
Oops, as the disclaimer-queen, I should perhaps have said that I'm not just fishing for feel-good comments here - just wanted a few things to be understood. Also I hope now I don't appear all clingy and silly for being so gushy in my thanks. A risk I'm willing to take, however.
Also it's probably time to introduce Vance and Brett properly. They're some of my youth group mates. Vance is also my fitness buddy (ha, in theory) and fellow cell group leader. Brett is also my workmate. He has a blog (brizzler.blog...). They are cool. And they know me well enough to tell a few stories if they chose, but...uh...I'm sure they wouldn't do that... (nice hobbitses)
Hehe - I think you're awesome too :)
From one bear to another.
Heya Katherine! I as well have gone through (am going through?) this stage. (although for me it was History and not Middle Eastern studies! ^_^)
We can proove Jesus existed. Its recorded by many other historical sources other than the Bible We can prove he was a real person.
What is the hard thing is it takes faith to believe he was ressurected. And unfortunately all our faith hangs on this one pivotal point. As Paul says, if Jesus hasnt been resurrected our hope is in vain and we are to be pitied above all others! :P
I was so worried (as u were) that when i told my friends what i was thinking, they would disown me and totally change what they thought of me.
I guess i could chalk at least one good thing up to alcohol. It gave me the carelessness to start blabbing on about what i was believing! :P But luckily i had better friends than that. i mean, im sure their opinion of me changed, but they helped me where they could!
Prayers for you that God will see you through it!
Yeah the first few years at uni can really force us to relook at our faith. Which is good when we survive it, but can be damaging with out support from others.
Remember others off us have gone through similar things if in slightly different fields and with slightly different Q's. So if you want some one to discuss things with ask us or indicate that your interested.
We are here to help each other and it's hard to do things completely by one self CU is not jsut about missions its there for other purposes to and strengthening each others faith and support each other is one of the Major ones!
hmm wonder if thats something that we need to pay more attention to at CU? As well as outreach might be an Idea to start looking to see if we can help other Christians on campus.
Any way God Bless and protect.
Katherine,
I think most thinking people reach a stage like this sometime in their lives. It's hard. I started going through it several years ago, and it took a few years before I saw it though. I think I am a better person because of it.
I think the thing that actually did it most completely for me was thinking about epistemology. ;) We can't actually prove anything, even the existence of the world is up for grabs. Personally, I find the concept of God more plausible than that of the world, so I'm inclined to be pretty well sure God is out there, but I do still wonder sometimes about the world... ;) Ultimately there are some decisions that have to be made in terms of epistemology as far as what we are going to believe. In practice we find there is a form of pascals-wager principle working: we believe the world really exists because the benefits if we are correct outweigh the losses if we are not. So, when it comes down to it, being a Christian is an arbitrary decision on your part - you can decide you want to be a Christian and live your life as a Christian, or you can decide not to. If being a Christian would make you happy - which I assume it would given that being in doubt about Christianity isn't making you happy, then that is all the justification you need in order to assume that Christianity is true. Philosophically speaking you're never going to get any evidence for it either way.
I can't say I've ever considered Islam as a serious option, I just see too many problems with it. Deism has always seemed the most plausible alternative to me.
As for freaking you out with my Romans reading, I'm not sure if that is good or bad... Christianity is a lot broader than a lot of Christians are familiar with and it's worth breaking the isolationism. There is actually a lot of middle ground between the fundamentalists and the Bishop Spongs of this world, and even within fundamentalism there are different opinions depending on whether you are Protestant, Catholic or Orthodox. I once thought "liberal" was one of the greatest insults you could give to Christians, but after a year of discussing Christianity with atheists on the internet I was calling myself a liberal. Since then I have been systematically going more conservative - it has been greatly helped by my discovery of Orthodoxy because many of the things I objected to in Protestantism and thought were part of my liberalness I have found were not not so liberal at all, and so I haven't had so much difficulty making the rest of my outlook less liberal. But when you praised me for "what it is to love the word of God, and to study it diligently" it reminded me that a very few years ago I would have considered most of the bible to be amusing false stories, and very self contradictory... I thought God existed and Jesus had lived died and been resurrected but I didn't think the Bible's testimony on the subject was reliable. Frankly, I still consider rational thinking as more important than what the Bible says, and if you proved to me that the bible said X when I believe Y for some good logical reason Z, I would say "that's nice" and simply believe the bible is wrong on that point. (I sometimes wonder if it's only people with this philosophy that should interpret the Bible: we have the least danger of reading into the text our beliefs as we are not desperate for the text to agree with our beliefs) When I was a liberal, I simply assumed the Protestant interpretations were right, and so I thought the Bible was all wrong. My great love for the Bible that you perceive is a general love for puzzles I have - working out what the Bible actually says is a challenge because so many people disagree. It's been a somewhat interesting suprise to find that the Protestant interpretations are actually the problem and that that the Bible actually says (as best I can determine it) is in large agreement with what I believed. Which is somewhat worrying in a sense, because the more I admit that the Bible is right, the more I lose my objectivity as an interpreter.
This comment is too long, I'm going to stop now...
*Warning: please do not read this comment if philosophical questions have not so far in your Christian life disturbed your equilibrium. I'm serious - please don't do it. Don't go messing with your head if it's not already messing with you of its own accord:)*
***
Andrew: I see you know where I'm coming from. Funnily enough, for me, the epistemology thing was a helpful realisation, when I started taking phil again this semester and found myself reading the kind of stuff you mentioned. Since I was already in the middle of this doubt thing at the time, it seemed kind of comforting to me to realize that we can't prove anything at all, even the most seemingly basic things, so the fact that I couldn't prove Christianity didn't need to bother me so much. Seeing it in this light, and assuming that to live without going crazy it is necessary to believe something, it becomes quite an heroic thing to cleave to some belief despite the lack of proof, and do so forever. Heh, so that thought sustained me for a while, until the next bout of questions came along.
"Personally, I find the concept of God more plausible than that of the world, so I'm inclined to be pretty well sure God is out there, but I do still wonder sometimes about the world... ;) "...yeah, that's about where I've got to.
"being a Christian is an arbitrary decision on your part"...yep, this was the thing that really terrified me. I even got pretty mad at God, for a while - something I don't do as a rule - for allowing the world to be constructed that way, making it so excruciatingly difficult for people like me to get on with life. He always seems to win those kind of arguments, however, what with having the whole "I know everything" card to play.
"If being a Christian would make you happy - which I assume it would given that being in doubt about Christianity isn't making you happy, then that is all the justification you need in order to assume that Christianity is true....surely there must be a better way? That's the very thing I'm really anxious to avoid - making a decision like that on such a basis as that. Being happy, to me, is definitely in the 'optional' category, while living according to what's true is not. It's just not good enough. How can God expect that of us?
Re. the Romans reading etc.: the thing about it that I found helpful was, I think, that it opened up the possibility that my hesitations about Christianity could perhaps be due to something other than my own stubbornness and lack of faith, viz, that my previous understanding of Christianity itself had been wrong. It would be great if you're right and God doesn't demand blind belief, but simply living well and loving Him, because that much I can do (insofar as any of us can, obviously). As I said on Reuben's post, though, I don't want to just go latching into whichever interpretation best suits my current struggles and gets me off the hook for finding it hard to 'believe'. So, yeah, I'm just taking this one very cautiously at this stage. Oh, and the other thing about it was that it potentially helps to explain Islam for me. In fact, it sounds pretty similar to it, from what I've been learning.
Re. your love/otherwise for the bible: well whatever your attitude really is towards the bible, my point is that you reminded me how to love it by suggesting things that forced me to really study it again, which I've been too lazy to do for the past year or two. This has been helpful, just to get back into the groove of thinking along the old familiar lines for a start, enjoying the bible and the challenge of making some kind of sense of it, as opposed to drawing back from it in suspicion.
Thanks for the comment. There is no such thing as too long! I might remove this one once you've read it, coz I really don't want to go spoiling things for people, stumbling blocks and all. (Hence I didn't post about all this stuff till now. Still not sure it's a good idea.)
God bless you
-kt
Ross - that would be good, thanks
:)
Katherine,
I too was also very conscious of the problem of setting up stumbling blocks for people, so I didn't tell any of my friends what I thought for many years. It's been a fairly careful and deliberate decision this year on my part that my friends have got to an age and place that they can now cope with both with the serious issues and what I think, and I feel secure enough in my beliefs and friendships to say what I think even when it's against the grain without being too worried that I might be wrong or excluded... babying most of my friends or myself was just no longer justified. You're really the youngest of the group, but you're a thinky person and it seems my discussions are more likely to help you than hurt you.
I think there are good logical and evidential reasons to be a Christian. The best way to get more convinced is to read some books of stories of miracles happening to people. But there are no compelling 100% proof reasons to think Christianity is true, simply because there are no 100% proof reasons to believe the vast vast majority of things we believe. Our lives are operated on a complex system of various beliefs and assumptions. It is simply not necessary to prove Chrsitianity 100% because that sort of proof can virtually never be had, and we live our lives quite happily in other areas of it without that sort of proof. The best example I really feel is the existence of the world. We definitely cannot prove we are not in the Matrix, but it is convenient to assume we are not for the purposes of living our lives and acting. Basically the same seems to apply to Christianity. Many atheists tell me they cannot just force themselves to believe something, but the issue is not one of forced belief but of adopting a working assumption that is made in order to remove philosopically induced existential paralysis and allows us to actually live our lives, exactly like our assumption that the world exists: Even if it doesn't we choose to live our lives assuming it does because that's simply the sensible thing to do.
I even got pretty mad at God, for a while - something I don't do as a rule - for allowing the world to be constructed that way, making it so excruciatingly difficult for people like me to get on with life.I got annoyed with God too, for not showing up when I prayed. I would lie awake at night wondering it He was real, asking Him to talk to me or show me a miracle. He never did. I believe he has done so since then, but it has been at times when my faith was strongest.
I finally decided God that didn't really care what people believed, and I pretty much stick to that still... it's surprisingly biblically defensible even though I arrived at the conclusion on purely rational grounds. Whatever the standard is by which God judges, it must be applicable to all, and I consider the goodness or evilness of people an appropriate standard.
Being happy, to me, is definitely in the 'optional' category, while living according to what's true is not. Certainly. But where what's true is unknowable, it's then that you turn to the optional and go with what's preferable or deemed most likely.
How can God expect that of us?Well I don't think he does. Think of Paul's speech in Acts 17: God made the world and lets humans search for him and he overlooks the times when they don't find him.
Or consider one of Jesus' parables - the slave who was given less information about the master's will wasn't held as accountable for his failure to obey it.
It would be great if you're right and God doesn't demand blind belief, but simply living well and loving Him, because that much I can do (insofar as any of us can, obviously). As I said on Reuben's post, though, I don't want to just go latching into whichever interpretation best suits my current struggles and gets me off the hook for finding it hard to 'believe'.Well as I said earlier, I arrived at that opinion on pretty much purely logical grounds by considering such things as justice, God's love, the fate of the unevangelised, the fate of babies etc. And it's one of the reasons I like Eastern Orthodox Christianity because they agree with this. The fact that the Bible seems to agree with it too (when interpreted carefully and unbiasedly the the best of my abilities with more than a bit of help from modern scholarship) is sort of a cherry on the cake.
Oh, and the other thing about it was that it potentially helps to explain Islam for me. In fact, it sounds pretty similar to it, from what I've been learning.The area of the world where Mohammed lived would have been Orthodox Christian, so the Christianity he would have been exposed to was Orthodoxy, so yes, his close-to-Christian religion when he invented it would have been based on Eastern Orthodox Christianity.
I don't think it's necessary to remove the comments/post, admitting that you're struggling isn't going to make others fall...
Warning: please do not read this comment if philosophical questions have not so far in your Christian life disturbed your equilibrium.A fair call and one that I've got an equiv of in the draft of one of the posts I'm thinking about. We do need to be carefull about that the hopefully most who read this we know and at least I think most in the group are equal to any challange there may be.
For me the fear that my ideas and thoughts on various matters might damage others faith was also closely equaled with the fear of people reacting badly along the lines of you heretic!!! And not being interested in hearing the reasons or making any attempt to discuss the Ideas.
I even got pretty mad at God, for a while - something I don't do as a rule - for allowing the world to be constructed that way.This is also something that I've felt to a degree though possibly a lesser one as somewhere along the way in my 20 or so years I've had it hammered into me very strongly that God does things in his own way and has no reason or real need to explain him self to me. A tad fatalistic I'd admit but the phrase "If God will's/wish's it" is one that often comes to mind for me. Possibly it's more of a brethern thing I'm not sure as my earliest memories of church are brethern. Or quite possibly it's just something that no bodys mentioned here.
I'd also agree with Andrew, in that I think God cares very little about what we think/belive with regards to how/why and various other issues and more about our personally relationship with him.
One other thing that also drives my faith is the times when I've considered what it would mean to exist with out God. A completely meaningless existance where our only purpose is to be more effcient means of converting Matter and energy into Chaos/Heat (Very chemical/phsics point of view I'm sorry, but then I am a scince geek :) ). If you haven't thought about it it's not something I'd encourage you to try it's very, very scary to even half serriously consider the Idea.
Another thing I think I've found disturbing is the way my faith and belief's have seperated quite noticeably from my parent's views as I've started to think about it my self and consider various things. That combined with my study in areas my parents have no interest or knowledge in has produced a difference that I notice especially with my Mothers faith which is quite different from mine, I'm not so sure about my Father though a few years ago I thought he had some odd views on various things but these days I get hint's he's on a similar path to me if from a completely different angle and set of reasons.
Another thing that disturbed me was looking at how my beliefs were changing from what they'rd been at high school when I'd been going along to one of the local Baptist homegroups with a few people abit older than me. The views there where alot stricter and more traditional and seeing my self differing from people I'd admired and at one stage shared veiws with was also disturbing.
Over all though I think I can say that my faith has moved from faith for faith alone too faith based on reason and Logic. Now I know why and what I belive things I never new at High School.
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